I cut my shoegaze teeth on The Daysleepers back in 2008. To me they were the most enigmatic of the new lot of shoegazers, dropping the majestic Drowned in a Sea of Sound and immediately vanishing into the ether leaving the rest of us hanging on for a decade before announcing their next full-length. Creation is out Fall 2018.
As it turns out they aren’t all that inaccessible – they’re just regular, busy humans. Jeff Kandefer kindly consented to being interviewed for AE and I had the chance to ask ten years worth of questions about the band, their new album and marine life.
AE: There’s this music review trope that goes ‘no review of a shoegaze album released after 1995 is complete without a reference to how it is influenced by MBV/Slowdive/Ride.’ While I am sure this is not entirely untrue, I feel it’s unfair to the work and creativity the bands put into defining their sound. I can tell a Daysleepers track apart from a stack of other bands by the music alone, and I know I’m not the only one. This is just a really round-about way for me to ask the question – how did you and the band come to discover the sound that defines The Daysleepers?
Jeff: The sound in a way just defined itself. A happy accident I guess. When we first started this band my intention was just to make more shoegaze in the style of some of my favorite bands like Slowdive, which you mentioned. At first that’s pretty much what we did, but the sound evolved into something else by the time we got to Drowned in a Sea of Sound. Back in 2003-2004 I was really not able to find too many new bands making shoegaze music, at least not in a manner that I wanted to hear, so really we just set out to make our own. I guess others had the same idea because the scene started to grow again around the same time we put out our first two EPs.
I think our sound is defined by what influences us and those influences are not confined to the shoegaze genre. So even though we use the tools of the genre (reverb, delay, chorus, fuzz…) there are influences that take it in other directions too. I think we have a new wave feel at times and even some post punk elements here and there.
Your new album, Creation, releases later this year. Can you tell me a bit about your journey from Hide Yr Eyes to Creation? How have you seen your aesthetic evolve in that time – musically, lyrically etc.?
I just think as we mature as individuals the music matures naturally. Creation has a way more mature, developed, big sound and because we are producing it, every decision is one made by the band, not anyone else outside of it. We have been able to take more time experimenting and exploring guitar and vocal sounds which is really fun. Also I feel my songwriting and lyrics are the best I have written yet. They are really meditative and personal to me. When I listen to the old stuff I still love it but with the ten-year gap between Drowned in a Sea of Sound and Creation to me, I feel we have stepped up to a whole new level. I can’t wait for people to hear it!
The music industry is not the same beast it was in the OG shoegaze era and the odds of ‘profiting’ from music aren’t as high anymore. What are your thoughts on the Bandcamp and/or Spotify models for musicians? What would your idea of an ideal platform for listeners and musicians be?
All of these models have positives and negatives. I don’t think there is a perfect solution to it. Bandcamp is great and probably the closest thing to being perfect. I mean you can upload lossless audio, high-res artwork, sell merchandise and post a release immediately. It gives the artist so much control and I think it can bypass the need for an official website which can be an added expense that an artist no longer has to deal with. It pretty much is your own simple website. I just wish it had a blog feature and It would be perfect. Actually it would be perfect if they took 0% of sales but I think we need to be reasonable.
As far as Spotify and Apple Music go, I think these streaming services all serve a purpose. What they pay artists seems almost criminal but they are very helpful in making music accessible to more people. I can’t help but think it makes music less valuable and more disposable. It’s hard to value music and focus on specific albums when you have millions of songs at your fingertips. I stream and I buy digital tracks. I like the convenience of just being able to cull up a song when you want to hear it anytime and anywhere, but I have also started getting back into vinyl so I can just sit in my living room with the TV off and appreciate an album. It’s nice to hold an album in your hands and see and hear an entire artistic vision.
When I was younger often times I would buy an album because of the cool artwork or maybe because it was a band I knew but didn’t hear that particular album. Sometimes the album ended up being good, sometimes it didn’t. Other times I didn’t like the album at first but because I committed to the purchase I focused on it and gave it a chance. Some of those albums are my all time favorites now. MBV‘s Loveless was one of those albums for me. If I was a kid now I might have missed out on that because If I started to stream it and didn’t care for it immediately I’d probably just switch to something else and never go back. That’s kind of scary to think about.
What inspires the lyrics to your songs? What are you usually writing about?
I almost always write the lyrics last. Most times, as we are writing the music I develop a melody that I like and then at the end I fit words to it. The sounds and mood of the song often times pushes me in a direction for the lyrics. Lyrics are easily the hardest part of the process for me. It always seems like a struggle for the longest time and then all the sudden they just start to come together and in the end I am usually pretty happy with them. As far as what the songs are about it is pretty varied from song to song. Often times I’ll write about big abstract ideas but I still try to keep a human element there. I’ll write about life’s struggles, experiences, dreams, fears, nature/creation, moods…all kinds of things. Creation is a bit more of a concept album. There is a theme that runs through it and it is more of a spiritual one. Meditations of the universe, how it began, where it’s going and how we move along with it. While it seems like a big theme, I also think it is very human and relatable.
A little while ago I wrote a few lines on my interpretation of ‘The Soft Attack’ – the first song I heard by The Daysleepers, and one I never grew tired of. One interpretation was instinctive – it felt like it was about flying and freedom. The other I developed after I paid attention to the lyrics and then it sounded to me like someone throwing themselves into the ocean (seagulls, waves, drags me down… etc). I can’t stand the conflict – what is it about?
Interesting interpretation! I’m glad you told me that because I purposefully write songs so that there is room for the listener to interpret the words and sounds however they want. They all do mean something specific to me though.
‘The Soft Attack’ was written about a reoccurring dream I used to have where I am swimming in the ocean on a peaceful evening and meet my end at the jaws of a Great White Shark. For some reason the dream is always in black and white. If you wonder why the song sounds so liberating for something that subject-wise is kind of morbid, there is a reason for that. In the dream, the whole experience naturally seems terrifying at first but as the blood drains from my body I enter this peaceful, euphoric state. Everything feels warm and numb, and I sort of accept this as my end. In those moments where my vision starts to go dark it does feel like a very freeing, beautiful thing in a weird way. Leaving the world in a beautiful ocean, by a primitive creature, but somehow enjoying the last few minutes left in the world… there was something sort of beautiful in that.
If you know anything about Great Whites often times they’ll just take a bite or take off a limb and then swim away. Most times people die from bleeding out rather than a relentless attack. That’s the case here. So it’s not like a violent attack, it’s more of a soft one – get it? The original artwork I designed for the EP cover had this awesome image of a shark lurking just under the surface of dark water. It was both terrifying and beautiful but sadly the photographer wanted way too much money for me to use it, so I went another route and decided to leave that theme more of a mystery.
Can we talk about ‘Dream Within A Dreamworld’ for a hot minute? I feel like it popped up during the long break after Drowned in a Sea of Sound, hinted at the promise of a new album that year, and then vanished. Where did it come from? Where did it go? What’s the story?
Sure – that song was an experiment and really kind of a one-off. It was never meant to be the start of a new album, just a single. At that time we had been talking more about recording a follow up to Drowned in a Sea of Sound but we weren’t sure how to go about it. We didn’t want to record in a studio like the previous releases, we wanted to record and produce new material ourselves, but we didn’t have all the equipment necessary at that point to do it right. Our drummer, Mario, had the closest thing to a home studio at the time and he showed me an early demo of ‘Dream Within a Dreamworld’. I loved it so much that I asked him to send me a copy of it so I could record vocals for it. I had some recording equipment at home so I put down vocals and some keyboards. After Scott recorded bass we decided to mix and master it and use it as an experimental track to see if people would respond to it. I sort of didn’t expect anyone to care about it and all of the sudden we started getting fan mail and people raving about it on the internet. That track started us down the path of where we are today. We have much better equipment to record with now. Once I got everything I needed for my studio setup in late 2016 we started on Creation. ‘Dream Within a Dreamworld’ is pretty unique for us and favors a more New Wave sound. When I started writing the songs for Creation I knew I wanted to go in a very different direction than that.
You’re not the first shoegazers ever, but you’re definitely the one of the first bands responsible for the resurrection of the genre. I’m not from your country or continent, but I believe the scene was pretty tight in the late 2000s/early 2010s – I’m basing this assumption on band lineups I’d see littered across my Facebook. Is there anything you can tell me about how this scene (re)emerged in the States and what it was like then?
I didn’t know much about the early 2000’s shoegaze scene back then. All I knew was that my favorite bands were not making this kind of music anymore so I was determined to put a band together and make it myself if they weren’t going to. I saw Mojave 3 live around that time. I talked to Neil about Slowdive and at the time he was so dismissive about it. He was focused on different things. I thought to myself that if these forefathers of the genre don’t care about it then I guess I will have to. Out of that The Daysleepers were born. Like you said, we weren’t the first to bring it back. Bands like Airiel, Bethany Curve and Air Formation were doing their thing before we formed but I didn’t find out about them until a little later. By the time Drowned in a Sea of Sound came out it seemed like this revival was really picking up.
I’ve read that you have a 9 to 5 job as a designer and your own freelance business, which sounds pretty gruelling. You also make music. I, too, have a 9 to 5 job and I struggle to juggle that and maintain this blog. Tell me the secret behind your time management skills.
My secret is that I deprive myself of sleep in order to make progress on the music. I’m probably taking years off of my life but it is working! I’m getting the results I want but that is why it takes us a little longer. We really have to work around a busy schedule. There is something so meditative about writing, creating and producing late at night when the neighborhood is asleep. It’s so quiet and calm. I don’t really freelance anymore so that frees things up a bit. I know what you mean though. It is a juggling act for sure but I make sure I don’t overdo it too much. I want to enjoy the process and not feel too stressed to do it. I feel like I have a really good system to manage all of this now. When the album is finished I plan on getting a lot more sleep though.
Your comment on my Life on Venus post made my day. I know you’ve been asked this question before, but the answer must keep changing: What are your (other) favourite shoegaze bands from the last year or so?
That’s nice to hear. Thanks for writing about them! In my opinion I think Life on Venus is the best new shoegaze band in years and I think they deserve a lot more attention than they get. They nail all the classic elements that I love about shoegaze music, but they add something fresh to the genre too. The vocals and guitars are so beautiful and they strike that great balance between sadness and hopefulness. I’ve listened to that album so many times it’s ridiculous!
Over the last year I have been heavily involved in making our new album so I purposefully don’t immerse myself in new shoegaze bands because I don’t want to be influenced by trends or where they are taking the genre. I want to do what comes natural to us and go on those instincts. I think that’s how we get a great and genuine sounding Daysleepers album.
Having said that I do tune into my favorite shows on DKFM (When The Sun Hits & Somewherecold) to see what’s going on in the modern shoegaze world. Besides Life on Venus I really like Lowtide, Yumi Zouma, Softer Still, Nothing, The Morelings, Bellavista… A lot of other stuff I’m sure I’m forgetting. There’s so much shoegaze now and that is a great thing!
Finally, let’s not kid ourselves: We pretend we listen to nothing but shoegaze, post-rock and other musical intellectualisms, but our lizard brains crave a periodic dose of pop. What are some bands/artists you listen to who we wouldn’t have expected you to listen to?
I was raised on pop music in the late 80’s/early 90’s so I think that’s what drew me to dreampop. Under all that noise there are some really catchy pop tunes. Unfortunately, I don’t like hardly anything on the radio these days. I like some Lana Del Rey songs quite a bit though.
One thing people might not expect is that I am a huge fan of the more ambient sounding R&B artists like Sade, Maxwell and Eryka Badu. Sade is a huge vocal influence for me. She holds those long, beautiful, melodic notes that just drip like honey. Her album Love Deluxe is in my top 5 favorite albums of all time. I would love to see her live.
I love trance music and electronic stuff. I’m also really into Post-hardcore bands like Mars Volta, Circa Survive and Coheed & Cambria. I love old and modern Jazz. I’m a huge fan of all kinds of Indie rock/alternative acts like Interpol, The Shins, Bjork, Washed Out, Stereolab, Dinosaur Jr, The Mary Onettes, Bon Iver and so on. I love experimental instrumental bands like Tycho, Bonobo and Jaga Jazzist. I love 80’s music, 90’s grunge music… I’m all over the place. Of course my staples are The Cure, Slowdive, Cocteau Twins, The Smiths, The Chameleons and Depeche Mode.
